INTRO: (00:01)

At his worst moment, Sean Martin said that he received the best advice: simply perspective and gratitude. survival can look like a lot of different things, and so it's fitting that the healing journey can be just as diverse. And we'll talk about just how that advice made a difference in Sean's own journey. Coming up, Sean and I talk about the power of music, saying it how it is, and what it really means to change. Please note that this episode does touch on suicidal ideation, trauma and mental health. Please take it at your own pace. And if you need help, reach out to the 988 Suicide and Crisis Lifeline by calling or texting 988. Thank you for

 

Natalie Bulger (00:44)

Hey everyone, welcome back to another episode of Motivation N'at. I'm Natalie, your host, and this is where we take hot mess to high potential. Today I'm really excited because I get to touch on a new type of guest joining today, Sean Martin. And Sean is a musician and you're going to hear a lot about his music, what drives his passion in this world and what just makes him a wonderfully complex and layered individual in this space and in our world in general. So I appreciate the chance to stretch my opportunities with having a guest on that's not kind of my usual person that I fit with and Sean, you being willing to be that first kind of venture into this space on Motivation N'at. But let me explain just a little bit about who Sean is, who his band is, and then I'm going to let him tell you more about himself. So Sean Martin is the kind of end all be all everything for this band called The Quarantine. It's a grunge punk metal project, and it combines aggressive music with socially critical lyrics addressing politics, trauma, addiction, and overall modern life. And Sean brings to this a background not only in musicians Institute training, but also service as a US Army Airborne Infantryman. So you have this kind of again, layered, very kind of do different things in life that came together and are going to intersect in ways that we're going to talk about. And the quarantine continues to release purposeful music as an independent force in modern rock. And we can't wait to talk about the current album that's out there to stream, to listen to, to access. And I just want to say before we get any further in, Sean, thank you for your service. Having spent some time with the VA.

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It is something near and dear that we support our service members as they explore any parts of their lives during or after service. So thank you for all that you have done. And I'd love to hear a little bit directly from you. Like who makes, what makes Sean Sean and how has this quarantined project and band come to be?

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Sean Martin (02:50)

Well, thank you so much and thank you for your support. really appreciate it. So yeah, the quarantined came to be in 2010 in the studio and in 2012 live. I just confirmed with my friend, we played our first show on Cinco de Mayo in 2012. And so from there, you know, we...

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We went on to try and do not just playing around live, but also going after college radio. And at that time, the internet establishment for getting your music out there wasn't really all social media based. It was still very much important to reach out to those alternative types of venues. So we kind of started, you know, not looking at the, the, the, you know, big gigantic front gates we were looking at, how do we get in from the moat? You know, what, what is, what about the, what about under, is there a sewer grate that we can get in from under the thing? What if we catapult ourselves over the top of the wall? What if we do some crazy shit like that? That's kind of like the mentality, for the quarantine, you know, as far as the business side of things independently because a lot of times the, you're either not ready or you don't have all of the things that go out and just do a massive tour and jump onto another, another bill. Maybe you don't have the infrastructure, but you have to work with your strengths and turn them, turn those and work with your weaknesses so that they turn into strengths.

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Natalie Bulger (04:32)

Yeah, and this was not a question on the outline that I sent over. hopefully it's in line of kind of how you got here. But like, what was the first instrument you picked up? What was the first thing that hit you as like, music is this thing that really speaks to me and I want to be more involved than just being a listener. Like I want to be a part of creating it.

 

Sean Martin (04:54)

Yeah, well, honestly, I kind of started out from a place of performance. I started out being a performer, not necessarily a listener. Because I started out when I was four years old doing community choirs.

So they were telling me, ahead and sing this line. Everything I do, I do it for you. Yeah. You know, and I'm like, I don't know where that comes from. You know, I don't, I don't know where that it's like, it's really sweet when you do it like that, Sean. Okay. all right. Sure. I'll sing it like that. So, from a very young age, performance was very much the thing that, that I attached to, not just the vibing with it. That didn't really come until much, much later when I started to pay attention to bigger artists like Michael Jackson and Garth Brooks and Prince and Metallica and Black Sabbath. And then I would even take it into, know, like classical composers in Vivaldi and Tchaikovsky and Bach and Beethoven and listen to all of these orchestral things as much as closely as I would listen to Tupac and notorious big, you know, so I'm and this is, know, from 12 years old. My mom had to try to convince me to not buy Eminem, you know, we're at the music store and she's like, you can buy I'll buy all the rest of these albums for you if you just don't buy Eminem and I'm like, okay, sure.

 

Two weeks later, I go and take the money that I saved from her buying me all those albums to go buy Eminem and just hide it from her. So I would still continue to go after and have a lot of influences, a very wide influences of listening. It was very much trying to take it all in, emotionally speaking, what really, really drove me musically after I learned how to play guitar when I was 12 was punk music, grunge music and classic rock like Jimi Hendrix and psychedelic era, cream especially. That is what really drove me into, you you can express some things in this world that are weird.

 

You know, let, let, let's not just only focus on, the love song, but use it to a way to express the weird things in this world. You know, the stuff that we don't really talk about, you know, maybe the odd experiences that you had when you were smoking. Ooh, what about that? Before me, you know, before that, it, with me, it was very much religious based.

 

You know, I was, I grew up in a family that was very much religious based and a lot of those records that I would listen to before I was younger, I'd have to hide them, you know? So once I started to just be more open about that kind of thing, it started, you know, opening up a flood of, well, let's start being honest about the world. Let's start being honest about the interpersonal relationships. Why is it that all those people, we don't talk to them? Why is that? Why is it that these other people have way less than we do? And why is it that these people have way more than all the rest of us? Why is it that these people over in this country want to murder us?

 

And we want to murder them, but we're still calling ourselves good. What, what the hell is going on with that? So all of these questions were things that I were pondering when I was 15, 16 years old. And it started to, and I came up with the quarantine because it described the reality. It described the human condition of how we separate each other and how we otherize each other instead of realizing the one greatest truth of all, that we are all the fucking same.

 

Natalie Bulger (08:50)

It takes right into because you had a quote that I saw that talked about the importance of music being driven by substance intensity and purpose, right? And I think any of us that are avid listeners or engage in it in some way, we all can name the songs that actually invoke some of that in us. And they put words or they put sounds or feelings to the things we often can't put our fingers on. And what you touched on, you know, the other other rising of people. A former guest had said the other others. And I was like, yeah, there's a whole lot of those, right? And when you can't, when you don't know where you fit, when you don't understand kind of or have trouble processing what's going on, finding that music that has been driven by those same things without even realizing it really can be a triggering moment in life.

 

And, you know, so it was it a journey? I mean, you mentioned kind of going from the religious piece, you know, into where you are now. But do you feel that you have always been driven by kind of that core moment? Or is that something that you've built on over time? Where it's like, hey, you did it once. Now it's easier to do it even more. And it's easy. Like, it becomes it's almost a little bit of practice. Or has this just been how it's been for you?

 

Sean Martin (10:05)

Well, the search for authenticity in a world that constantly lies to you means you're fighting an uphill battle all the time. It's the easiest thing in the world to just continuously lie to yourself. It's real easy. Your life is pretty, you know, relatively manageable at that point when you don't have to ask a whole lot of questions.

 

I was the asshole who asked all the questions and I stood there with the middle finger until they gave me an actual reasonable answer. That's, that's how I am. And that is good and bad in certain situations. Sometimes that's acceptable. Sometimes you will never get into that room doing this, you know? So, that's kind of been the journey.

I've in that in that quest for authenticity means that you have to be the eternal student. You have to constantly be learning and constantly improving and looking not just for reassurance or validation, but for evidence for techniques, for abilities, for the actionable things in this world, to understand the words and the language that we use and figure out the ways to communicate people where they are, not just how you want to talk to them. And utilizing these mentalities that I, you know, I learned from many, different societies, being involved in many different aspects of a community's action, like religion and missionary work and going in evangelicals, know, that kind of stuff, being the military and being an instrument in patrol, going around and saying hi to all the people who you might have to go kill later. You know, then there's the, the ever grinding aspect of music marketing of constantly taking 10 million rejections to wait for the couple of one acceptances that you'll get, you know, dealing with not just the culture and the society, but also the interpersonal relationships. Who are the people that are close to you? Are they trying to screw you over? Are they actively looking out for your best interest? Do they understand exactly what you're going after? Or are they just making sure that you're not going farther than that? All of these things are part of my journey, directly. And they're obstacles. And what I... used to get myself through that whenever I had everything taken from me, whenever I had lost everything that I was going after, when I had every reason to say, I'm the victim now. I don't need to do anything more because this is what happened. If I stayed there, I would have died about 20 years ago. I had to learn how to get knocked down and pick yourself up and keep going further than they ever thought that you that they would go and also including yourself.

 

Natalie Bulger (13:29)

Well, and I definitely wanted to get into a little bit of that journey that you've been on, right? Because having spent time in the VA, know the transition from military back to life and transition into military too can be very disruptive in a lot of ways. It's a complete shift from the framework that supported you. And to be honest, we don't do a great job with that transition and that support as a country and as a whole no matter how many nonprofits you see out there, or even the organizations federally that exist. And a lot of times there's ways for us to explore how do we do better at that. And I wanted to pick your brain a little bit about that transition. And when you mentioned, when I had nothing or when I was like, where do I go from here? How did the steps in those path look?

 

We romanticize, right? We're like, one day you realize that your love has been in this one place this whole time and now you do it and everything's okay. And that's not how it works. There's a lot of, as you mentioned, obstacles along that path. So, you know, what did that shift look like for you? you know, who was involved in it? Was it primarily self-driven? Were there other people that stepped in and engaged along the way?

 

Sean Martin (14:52)

Yes, there was, I started out trying to do it on my own and I had friends, you know, going to music school. You know, in 2009, I get out of the military, I get out of the military in 2007. I go to music school in 2009. So I had two years to kind of reintegrate. had, you know, girlfriends, I played in other bands. I... you know, had many different other jobs. I, you know, became a, in my mind, a relative living civilian. But when I came to then coming back to music and making music my entire day and everything that I express, I express it through music. I don't talk anymore.

I play and people will feel what I'm thinking, right? Like that's the goal. So, so you're actively trying to, to make music a mode of communication, not just something you do. and that, helped me in a lot of ways, but it did stunt me. And it wasn't until 2012, after I graduated, that I went through the therapy that I needed to deal with all of the things that had happened in the military and in my childhood. Because they're both intertwined when it comes to the mentality of somebody's overall mental health.

 

You can deal with just the issues in, in, you know, in current service. Yeah. But however, the decisions moving forward are going to include all of that because that's where your mind is at, whether you like it or not. and once you start to understand how to, how to tap into your subconscious and start being able to think about how you're thinking and observe how you're thinking, I didn't come to any of that without 18 big ass team. And I was very, very lucky that I was able to be in those situations. I had to apply to go to this inpatient clinic. When I was in the VA psych ward, I had to go and get, you know, stand in front of a board of doctors. And they all grilled me about everything. It felt like a crazy experience considering that I'm at the craziest point that I've ever been at in my entire life. And now I'm standing in front of a panel of six or seven doctors and they're all asking me like, so how do you feel about your future? What do mean? How do feel about my future? I hear chains rattling above me when I sleep. What do you think my future feels like? You know, the ward above us was the one where they were the people have to be restricted.

 

They have to sleep, you know, in that. So that was the word right above us. We hear the chains dragging on the ground. was crazy. And we're and we have. So at that point, like so many different normal faculties were taken from me. Because through through PTSD, because I didn't know just how badly the nervous system was affecting everything that I do. And that's still, I still have to take nervous system breaks. Even just this last week, three days completely shot for those three days came on randomly. No reason, no particular reason why, but it just sunk me into this depression. And if I didn't understand what was happening and going on, it could just go and go and go further and further and further down. And you just drink heavily and then eventually you just kind of forget things, but there's still in your past, you still hold a grudge against yourself. That, that once I realized that was what was happening, then I was able to start having a, a, understanding of how to deal with it.

 

And so, so that transition that happened into the civilian world in 2007 was severely delayed until 2013, 2014, when I actually understood what the hell was going on with me. And then I understood how, how to have coping mechanisms. And then there was the, the, the ways to get in front of it, the true understanding of what is going on inside your brain, the chemical makeup of, of, then identifying those chemicals with an actual feeling. So you know what dopamine feels like, you know what serotonin feels like, you know what cortisol feels like, and you know what adrenaline feels like. And then you can start analyzing yourself and then creating a new input to manage those chemicals specifically.

 

Then when you can do that, that only comes from a team of knowledge. Think I knew that shit beforehand? Hell no. Hell no. I'm like, this shit, I'm crazy. You know, that's the language that I had. I feel crazy. It wasn't until then I actually had experts be able to explain it to me. And that's what makes my situation very lucky, very, very lucky. And I know that.

 

Natalie Bulger (19:46)

Well, and even calling out that delay and I mean, it's a long journey. mean, who's to say in 10 years, there's not another thing that you learn about the whole piece, right? And then you process again. And, and we see that a lot. And I think it's, it's a reminder to give grace, right? Someone's like, I got this handled. I've been to therapy. It's all understood. And then like new experience. And it's like, no, just kidding. Just kidding. I'm back to square like three, maybe not one, but three. But let's so you bring up chemicals, you bring up nervous system. And we know scientifically that there is a connection with vibrations and music, right to how our body can react to things. I love soundbaths. I'm that person that like give me weird chimes and noises. And I literally will fall asleep. I fall asleep in an MRI machine because of the thuds like they just like calm me down to like this, this place. And so have you, have you experienced that as well? Like you found certain things that when you play them, like they almost reprogram certain things that happen or your reactions that happen, or maybe it's your fans or anyone that's listening that goes, all it took was that song. And like all of a sudden I just like it grounded me, it brought me here or it lifted me in some way. Do you get that? Do you hear about that as kind of a side effect?

 

Sean Martin (21:26)

Yes, absolutely. And that is a, you know, more directly, audio therapy is truly a thing, not just to help you sleep. I mean, there's lots of the whale noises and the rainforest noises and the ocean noises and all those things. I mean, they help me too. But for me, a lot of times, because I'm so audially driven that... random noises and stuff makes my brain too active. So a lot of times to help me sleep, doesn't necessarily work directly when I'm sleeping, but you know, sometimes putting on a movie that I'm very, very familiar with helps just relax your nervous system just a little bit more because you can lay there and still be like, you know, even if it's just on the inside, I'm pretty sure all of us know that. So there, you know, there, there absolutely is a great scientific connection between audio and, and, and vibration and us humans, not just with our ears, but because it moves through our entire body and that, and those vibrations, those slight little vibrations, is moving things on a molecular level. So for example, I can't say that, you know, because I'm not a physician, that this particular outcome is exactly how it will be. It'll be for everyone. But I do know that when I was recovering from knee surgery, I would, when I would be mixing music, I would put the speaker right next to my leg and prop my leg up and play the music through my leg. And I could feel it. And there was, it would never hurt it at all. But after six months of doing that, even the physical therapist was like, how in the hell are you able to be this mobile after the year? Normally people aren't like this. I'm like, it's cause I play music on it every single day.

 

You know, sometimes I wouldn't do all of the stretches because my memory is always not so great about, you know, the day-to-day stuff. I'll get focused on doing things and you get taken off, you know, all the time. But there's a definite aspect of music healing and it's in the vibrations.

 

Natalie Bulger (23:57)

I think, you know, there's, I've spoken to some other folks that have created for people that are deaf or hard of hearing actual pieces they can wear and it helps them hear the music because it actually creates vibrations in the internal ear canals and all kinds of science that I don't understand. But it just, you know, there are other ways to tap into what it develops for you.

 

And that's kind of the theme through this whole piece is the healing aspect of all of this that you have done and lived and now sharing with others. But it takes me to the album that you've released just late last year, The Aversion to Normalcy, which you have described as a cathartic confrontation with trauma resilience and the illusion of normal my favorite part of the whole thing right this illusion of normalcy that we're all striving for holding ourselves accountable to you and I would love to hear what it what does that mean to you like what does this album the songs on it the drive to create it why was this confrontation so important and what does it translate to people who may be listening to it or interested in hearing it.

Like, what's it going to mean to them?

 

Sean Martin (25:07)

So, yeah, so I have a line that goes along with the album. That's when tyranny becomes the norm. In order to survive, you'll need an aversion to normalcy. And that is describing the situation not as... this is a big large society in front of me and I have to assimilate into it. I must be a part of it. Instead, it's saying this is a big large society that's in front of me. They are absolutely fucking out of their mind. They are absolutely insane. There is no good reason for anything that they do. They are the crazy ones. How do I exist in that society? Do you just go under the radar the whole time?

Try to avoid everything? do you actually, eventually you're going to come across confrontation because you're going against the society. So how do you then prepare yourself? How do you deal with the reactions to and the feelings of I'm not being accepted? And that's normally a bad thing. And then you have to change your mind and think I'm not being accepted. Then I'm doing my job.

 

It's a very different mentality. But I think that if we're going into a society and as a principle and we want to change something, well, better stop assuming that the people you're trying to change are sane. Otherwise you wouldn't have been here trying to change their insane policies. Right? So it's a very, this I'm trying to get good people to start thinking of not just the boundaries that you put up for yourself in your interpersonal relationships, but what are the boundaries and responsibilities from a person to a institution, to a society, to a government, to the people who own you, rule you, your jobs, your bosses, your shareholders. is your responsibility when you see that they are crazy?

 

Natalie Bulger (27:07)

And it's a scary place to go, right? So I think like creating this, there's a movement aspect, right? It's like, be unique, be the disruptor, do that thing. But also, you're not alone, ironically, in this. There are other people who probably feel very much the same way. So don't fully be afraid that you will be thrown to the wolves. If and when you find that voice and you start using that voice is a little bit of the element I hear, right? Because honest, the that level of disruptor is there's a lot of people sitting there that probably don't realize the power they can or might have if they did something.

 

Sean Martin (27:47)

Yes, absolutely. The power of the voice, of an articulate voice that is thought out, has more power than I think most people realize. When you can stay focused on a particular problem and follow it through to the end, not just bitch and complaint about it, but follow a solution through to the end to make it better for everyone around you. Because you're adamant, because you're passionate, because you're knowledgeable, and because you have empathy, you will create a solution that is better than what exists. It's important to remember that that is the power. It's not going about it violently. It's not going about it burning everybody down.

 

It's not going about it in the way that you see, you know, happen in politics is dirty mudslinging politics that it's been going on forever before it wasn't so big of a deal. Now it's so big of a deal. Why? Because people put more weight to it. Why? Because real solutions weren't being offered.

 

What is the counter argument to all of fascism? Freedom and independence. The ability to do things on your own and how that creates more life, liberty and pursuit of happiness than any kind of overarching security ever will. This is why we have the sentence of, if you give up your liberty for security, you deserve neither. This is why.

And so I wanted to play out that situation, that scenario for people in an album, because not only have I seen it, I've lived it. Not only have I gone against major, huge things that were way bigger than me, but I fought them in my own way with finding my own level of success to get out of it. And that success usually was survival.

But now I'm trying to take it into, let's make it successful in the world. not just for me, but for my entire society. Because what is the point of me being solely successful when everyone else around me is absolutely struggling and dying?

 

To me, it just doesn't make any damn sense. So I wanna try to give that example for people who are creating music, for people who wanna be role models, for people who wanna make an art expression that says something to people. I wanna start giving an example. Let's start getting deep with it. Let's stop with the superficial bullshit. Let's try to make some art that makes people wanna do the right thing and critically think. And that's what this is about.

 

Natalie Bulger (30:29)

Well, and I think it comes at a beautiful, perfect time, right? So we have this element of, and I'm going on a tangent here, so apologies, but we have this infiltration of my favorite topic on every episode I've done, AI, into the world, right? So we're hearing AI music come up. We're hearing all these people who now think that they can do all of this work themselves be like, I'm just gonna do that. I'm gonna design my own stuff. I'm gonna do this all day.

And it's almost now hit this wave of I've realized how much I can't do myself and how much I don't want to pay a mega box place to do. And the amount of small businesses I have discovered in the last three months because AI has taught me I can't do it. And it has also taught me the other people who think they can do it that are doing like have not utilized the expertise around them. And I mean, it's far to go like, hey, can I get an opening song written for this or for that? Like not assuming that some algorithm can make it be what you need it to be without the human behavior element associated with it. And I think too, and it's a shout out, it's funny I'll connect you after this, but we have a little indie radio station that just popped up out of nowhere a couple of weeks ago that they're like, we are tired of the same 40 songs on the radio we are going to play specific indie music and when you say indie music this is what we mean and we have a song singer songwriter room popping up in town that I had no idea was coming and I'm like my god are we going back to this place like weird community power pieces because we realize how much we've given up in the process to just assume an amazon can do it or a walmart can do it for us and they can't. So I think that like this, a, it's almost, feels like a thematic, you know, like music set of motivating component that can play underneath this movement that we're in right now is this whole idea of we're, there's a whole generation of people going, what the fuck is this normal thing I've been aiming for for so long? It kind of sucks.

It's no fun. Like, I want to do something different. And so I think it's a scary feeling at first view, right? Who's going to think I'm weird? Or who's going to think I'm different? And what does that mean? And realizing that it's not. It's like the normal is actually to be completely not normal.

 

Sean Martin (32:53)

Yeah. You know, you bring us some very good points and, and, I would say that, in the process of human exploration, what we normally go through is a process of can we do that? And then after we figure out that we can do it, we go, should we?

 

Should we? We need to do the opposite. And with AI, we have a very unique situation where I think people are starting to realize because can I create an entire song with AI? Yes, I see the Viking dudes all the time.

And if you don't know those videos, fucking AI, you're absolutely stupid. Stop it. Stop it. Second of all, we're coming into the process of, of, of coming across that thing. Should I? So when we start to look at AI to fill in the gaps of what we don't know, instead of what we can do ourselves and use our strengths forward and then use AI to fill in our weaknesses until we understand what those are and then fill them in ourselves. We can use AI to be that bridge of the gap of the knowledge that we don't have. But if you use AI to create everything, then that's when you're going to get the six-fingered hand and be like, well, it's good enough. I guess you get an idea. It's a hand. No, you want to be specific, especially when it comes to a business plan. You can't have no six-fingered hands in your business plan.

I hope you guys get the metaphor there. But the point is, is, you know, and, you know, third. We, this is bringing up the exact, the exact thing that technique and ability is truly what makes you human. When you develop yourself and you invest in yourself, then you're always going to see a dividend. So why aren't you investing in yourself all the time? That's truly the face of the question that we've been faced with, that we've had to confront since 2020, since COVID. I mean, before, for me, I was asking this question when I, before I was 21 years old. Is life too short to go after what you really want? And my answer was, it is way too goddamn short. You better hurry up and start doing what you want. Stop hurry up and waiting. Hurry up and get where you need to be that it was a fire was lit under my ass literally. The bomb blew up. My Humvee exploded into a fire. I had to dislocate my shoulder in order to get myself out of a fire inferno. I literally had a fire burned under my ass and to realize that life was too short. The rest of the world came around in 2020 when we realized, man, everyone around me is dropping dead for no good reason. What the going on? Life's too goddamn short.

 

It's time to start building up our ability to start investing into ourselves to realize that the investment in community starts from treating yourself the right way. Then once you learn how to treat yourself the right way, you start to realize that loving people is not loving them the way you want to be loved, but loving them in exactly the way that they need to be loved. Caring for someone is about giving them what they need, not just a normal stock box thing. Here you go. Here's your, you know, program, what you need, all you need is a bed, right? That's all you need. So go fuck yourself then. No, it needs to be specific. Help needs to be specific. So when we start approaching our community in that way and also start using government to help people the most instead of just corporations, then we've actually got a society that sustains itself instead of one that's constantly fighting against each other for the basic necessities, which is what we have right now.

 

Natalie Bulger (36:58)

And I'm going to pull this back because the one thing I wanted to touch on, it may feel disconnected at first, but it will connect, is there, you know, we know back when we look at healing journeys that healing journeys are very unique and sometimes they require some strange things to help us get through them. And one thing that has been the very hot topic in the veteran space has been using psychedelics and other, you know, holistic alternative treatments versus just handing over the Zoloft and the Prozac and all those kinds of things and sitting in front of a physician panel asking, how do you feel? Are you crazy? And so much of that has been, I think, delayed and held back because of the desire of certain groups to have control over what can we tax, what can we not, who can get it, who can't. And you've been very vocal on saying, hey, some of these things are common sense. Like, put a voice to it now that you have kind of this advocacy voice. What are some of the things that, you know, anyone who's listening should know about these alternate treatments for PTSD, especially, and how powerful they can be from someone who kind of knows it, lives it within it and

 

I mean, you mentioned, you hey, that, that when I smoked less that inspired a song or I wanted to talk about it afterwards. Cause you know, it, it opens up a different set of feelings. Take us into that space briefly, you know, so that people, I think this is a topic they avoid a lot, right? It's like, my God, we can't make that legal or we can't make that accessible. And it's like, no, get over it. there are definitely reasons why we need to have the conversation.

 

Sean Martin (38:39)

Yes. so should I, should I keep it tictok friendly?

 

Natalie Bulger (38:45)

No, I mean, I'm fine. This is whole point of this podcast is to go to the places that we don't usually go to. So take us there.

 

Sean Martin (38:51)

That's what was...

Okay, great. So, marijuana, marijuana, okay. So let's understand first off that the, we have a cannabinoid system in our body that is directly connected to our nervous system. Every human has it. So let's first understand that that is defined fact, scientific biological fact. No other drug has an entire system built into our normal systems that is made specifically for processing and distributing THC to every single part of your body. There's no other drug that has that. So let's first understand that cannabis and humans are like peanut butter and jelly. They're meant to go together on a biological level on a scientific biological level. let's first establish that as fact. So then second of all, when you have a nervous system disorder like mine, where you need to be able to tap into that nervous system and put a lever into it so that you can control where it goes, like a rudder. Well, marijuana and the cannabinoid system is that direct connection.

 

So it's very, very important for the scientific community, the advocate community, the government community to realize that you can try to legislate this way, but it's never gonna work because cannabis is literally built into our systems built into our bodies. And right now they want to get, you know, real happy with legislating away women's autonomy. So I know that they want to do it. They are perfectly fine with denying what is naturally human. We know that already. So the fight is in front of us. However the talking about the effects of it and having people realize what it can do for them is the perfect example of the philosophical example that we have to that not everything that is legal is moral and not everything that is moral is legal. So once we start bringing these fundamental truths up, into our normal understanding, are we all gonna collectively see what needs to be done to make this world a better place? Because sitting around smoking a joint with everybody was exactly the way that we squashed beef for thousands of years.

 

Natalie Bulger (41:46)

Well, and I don't think even people realize probably the difficulties that this has created in groups like the federal health system who cannot prescribe medical marijuana to a veteran who qualifies under every other way to get it, they can't do it. And they can't even really refer you to someone or answer questions. Like it is so constrained. And then federal employees are under very strict things. Like when I was an employee, I couldn't get medical marijuana. I stepped out. Very first thing I did was go get that medical marijuana card the day that I got off of federal employment. And because it does, there is a... Every single thing in this world can be overused and over abused. Everything, food, water, you know, we know alcohol can. It's not to weaponize one thing and be like, people abuse that or it's gateway or it's this, you know, is they are control efforts by those that want to have the power over those conversations and those areas. And it happens every day and we don't even realize it. And this is just one where I think it becomes very visible.

 

So I would say, you know, I don't know anyone who has gotten a medical marijuana card or smoked it on their own and been like, that was the worst thing that ever happened to me. Like you hear about it randomly when people are like, yeah, it opened me up to all these other worlds. like everyone that I know is like, yeah, no, I hit my pen once a week or, you know, it's on Sunday nights before the Sunday scary is hit and it's what gets me through it, you know, kind of thing. And so I think we have to give power to those voices and honestly advocate the whole way around, even if it's not for you. I guarantee you, you know someone that it benefits. I guarantee you.

 

Sean Martin (43:35)

Yeah. The, the, the truth is, is you're actually touching on something very important there. Marijuana actually in cannabis in its forms right now, in all of its forms is not for everybody. It's important to realize that what cannabis does is it opens up your mind and your body to feel normal, to feel a norm. And what I mean by that is balanced, a balanced baseline of your nervous system. That's what normal is supposed to be where you're cool. You're fine. You're not in pain. You're not worse off than you were before. You're mentally present, balanced. When you get to that point, your natural inclinations are going to come to the forefront. So if your natural inclinations are I am pissed off about all of this stupid shit, including you. Guess what you're going to do? Guess what you're going to do if your natural inclinations are, man, I am just so happy to finally just feel relaxed. I can't wait to watch this, you know, this episode or whatever and eat some cheetos and just relax because I haven't been able to relax for the last years. Guess what you're going to do. So It's important to realize that cannabis opens up us to have freedom, to not be held back by the normal aches and pains, the simple aches and pains, to not be held back by the mental fog, to not be held back by the self-conscious issues that we always put in front of ourselves to tell ourselves that we shouldn't, it doesn't inhibit your inhibitions. It makes you sharper and clearer.

 

It makes you understand much more what's going on. a lot of things that you've been denying your brain. Cannabis removes the lies that you tell yourself. And sometimes people can't handle that.

 

Natalie Bulger (45:30)

Well, and I know, you for me, very anxiety and migraine driven is where it, you know, tags in and you don't realize how much things like anxiety steal from you in your day until you calm down the crisis that is just constantly it's spongebob, right with the room on fire and your brain. And it works like a little bit of a fire extinguisher for a little bit. And it's like, yo, no, just let the bonfire in that section. Like you're good.

It doesn't need to be fully put out, but you know, and so I think the way that a lot of us were taught to digest this idea was that it muted you. And instead I was like, no, it just turned the damn volume down. Like it's so loud sometimes. And to your point, there's so much science around like what strain works for you and what else. That's, know, I'm glad we can openly talk about that in some different places, but there's still so many restrictions and red tape. So it's really, it's really tough. I'm so glad that you brought a little bit of that science and knowledge to the listeners today, because a cannabinoid system is new to me. So now I get to go look into that and I will stick a reference in the show notes so people can look at it. So we go. So as we get kind of into the close up session of this and we'll talk about where to find the album and where to find more about you and the band.

 

Sean Martin (46:40)

yeah, please.

 

Natalie Bulger (46:50)

You know, you mentioned early on this idea of, there's a lot of rejection in this industry and there's a lot of rejection everywhere right now. Like job markets are really, really tough. Online dating has made rejection really common in the relationship world. You know, how have you over the course of this time managed that rejection? Do you have any tips for those that are like going through their first round of things that you have found have really helped and how to celebrate the wins when you do get them?

 

Sean Martin (47:19)

Yeah. Let me start and preface this by.

Okay, no, I'll just go into the first thing. When it comes to the music industry rejections, well, no, there's an element of this that includes in personal rejections too. Just because you're not right for right now doesn't mean you're not right at all. This is a very important thing. Just because one person rejects you doesn't mean that you're It doesn't make any, that doesn't follow logically, you know, it's taking one example and blowing it up. So we have to be very careful not to do that because that's the fallacy that all of our minds goes to. So once you restrict that, then you're going to stay on a relatively balanced level. The second thing is, is that they did that for a reason. What was the reason? And if the reason is a legitimate valid thing that you do need to work on, well, then you just gave yourself some homework.

 

And then a rejection becomes the ladder that you use to become better than you were before. That's the best case scenario, right? So you'd get there in two steps instead of a whole bunch of run around worrying. third, when it comes to, when it comes to rejection and yourself, and you know, every day that your video doesn't get 10,000 views, it can feel like a rejection.

 

it's important to realize the system that we have set up right here, you know, for all of social media is not a reflection of your personal worth or value. How many people see your podcast is not a reflection of how good the podcast is. How many people listen to your music is not a reflection of how good the music is. It's very important to realize that these, measurement sticks that we have are not your value. There, let me rephrase it. They're not your worth. They're your immediate value. Your worth is more than your immediate value. Your worth includes your potential. Your worth includes all the different things you have planned, the things that will come in the future when you build upon them. Your value is speculative in the moment. Don't put any, any actual emphasis on your value. That changes. It's speculative means based on the perspective, it'll be different. This is important thing to realize that that's how the world is looking at this. Don't take it personal. Even, even a rejection from a person in dating, don't even take it personal because most of the time it's not even about you. It's about them. So it's important to realize that when you're dealing with a society, the most worthwhile thing that you can do for yourself to increase your overall worth is to have an establishment of who you are. Know who you know, thyself first and foremost. You've got to because then you can go in knowing your worth. Even if someone devalues, devalues you, you can prove them wrong through your ability and technique that you fostered in yourself. So when you do that, someone can devalue. Sure. Fine. Go right ahead and I'll easily crush it just because because that's my worth. See it.

 

Natalie Bulger (50:50)

And I think we're actually going to wrap on that note because it is such a beautiful way to bring this all together, which is the idea of when you know yourself, then you can invite people to know you. Before you know yourself, who are you inviting them to know? Some cookie cutter mask that you've put on or that now you're afraid it's always going to get ripped off. And what I hear from you and obviously from the extent of time over the work is that

 

Sean Martin (51:06)

And what for? Yeah.

 

Natalie Bulger (51:19)

You've invited people in to see who you are, Sean, through your music and through this work that you do and been very just transparent and open about it. And I think through that, people may only latch onto one little piece, but that one little piece contributes now to who they know they are or one little piece that drives them to explore that next little component because we are so fricking unique and everything that we do and every one of our experiences has made us us. And we're so... consumed with striving to be what we consider to be that normal element, that we forget how beautiful those unique components are. So I think that that just really evokes a feeling. You haven't played one little thing of music on here, but yet you are creating like verbal music with this and bringing that same feeling about. And I think it's really, you know, going to resonate with people. So.

​

Sean, what are some of the final things you want to remind folks of as they transition out of today's episode? And where can they find what we've talked about today? Where can they stream that album? Where can they find more about you? you know, I think you're located in California, so anyone that's listening out in that way, you know, might even be able to track you down for a performance that you're having. So tell us a little bit about that and close us out. What do we take away today?

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Sean Martin (52:39)

Sure. So the thing that I'll leave you with is the best advice that I got when I was the most suicidal. And that is when you're in that place, you're missing two things. One, perspective. You're missing the greater picture. You're only seeing it from one particular area. Either it's just yours or through somebody else's eyes at you.

​

So when you start gaining perspective on the situation, on yourself, on the other people, on the real, you start to realize what is real, not just what I feel. You start to open up your mind into greater possibilities than just this is it. Second thing you're missing to take you further is gratitude. Gratitude at least for yourself. Even if you are completely surrounded by assholes and nobody deserves any of your gratitude, guess who still does? You.

​

So when you remember those things, you can get through the worst feelings that you've ever had in your entire life. Even the ones that you don't even know yet with perspective and gratitude. So with that, go to thequarantine.com to go and listen to more of the music. Follow us on social media, at thequarantined on TikTok, Instagram, Facebook.

search for us, on bandcamp, the quarantine.bandcamp.com. have our full discography there. that's not available anywhere else. and you can buy it, highly, highly recommend buying it. you can name your own price. We have a merch store coming very soon. We're going through the first initial tests of it. So watch for that soon. It's going to be a streetwear brand all on its own. It's going to be great. it's to be the best thing you've ever seen. And, and.

And on that, we've got tours coming up. We've got more videos. Follow us on social media to stay connected with the content. I'm going be doing all kinds of performance and stuff with the setup I've got here. In fact, today, I'm going to be working on it. So we've got lots of great things coming.

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Natalie Bulger (54:34)

Awesome.

Fantastic. And if you need all that repeated again, either hit rewind and listen, but also go to the show notes because you're going to be able to find all of those links in the show notes today to hear directly from Sean, hear his music with the quarantined. And Sean, I wish you the best of luck because really this is just, you know, anytime we talk to people here on Motivation N'at, they clearly are building space for change that we may not even be able to fully identify yet, right? It's just this feeling that something is brewing and whatever it turns out to be is going to be important for someone somewhere. And that is a beautiful thing. And I'm so glad you reached out, wanted to come on and that we were able to make this connection. So Sean, thank you so much. And thank you everyone for listening. Join us again soon for another conversation of taking hot mess to high potential. Talk later.